"He tried to cuddle with me after we hooked up and i just looked at him and said why are you still here?"

Sunday, 31 July 2011

Life in a call centre, Part 2

In this evening's episode, we expand more on all the unbridled passion you find in call centres.

I maintain that we are all part of some secret government breeding programme... we reproduce to further the next generation of phone monkeys, each slightly more slutty than the last...

We were introduced to what was deemed normal behaviour early on in our call centre lives; my first line manager (on my first day) announced he was leaving his wife because his girlfriend (one of our team) was pregnant with his baby. His 6th child. With 5 different women. All of which had worked at this call centre at one point...

You know what? He was old and ugly and balding and he had tits that would have put my flabby ex to shame. But he was one of the few male managers on the floor and that was apparently enough.

Within 6 weeks of starting, one of my fellow trainees left after discovering she was pregnant by another one of our team members. She had a termination and then could not face the gossip. She went to another call centre and got knocked up again but she kept the second one; now lives on state benefits down the Taff Embankment.

My own (now former) best friend also left after getting pregnant by a team member and then suffering a miscarriage in work. Do none of these kids understand the concept of birth control?? I am surprised there are not more STDs going round the office.

A little aside... I once had a chat with a few of these kids about their attitude to contraception. They all confirmed they did not bother using any. I guess growing up in the 1980s under the shadow of AIDS made me a little more sensible...

This one woman (I actually cannot remember her name so I will call her Sarah) was really loud (and really quite ugly to be technical... but having big tits and loads of make up apparently causes all the boys to fall over themselves). She was doing a team coach (4 kids by the time he was 26... though he is a nice guy and a good mate of mine) but she was not getting what she wanted so she dropped him for her own team manager. Suddenly Sarah was promoted to team coach...

Then there's these two managers. She's a two-faced lying piece of shit and he HAS TO BE GAY. I don't care what anyone says - that guy is gay! How can anyone live in denial for 45 years?!! They were together for ages. Then her boyfriend found out.

Speaking of which... that painted trollop was shagging one of her colleagues til her husband found out. That was quite funny. Who would want to stick it in that decaying cesspit?

The lads on my team would point out girls they'd had. And there were a surprising amount...

One girl (lovely lass, I might add) moved to Australia, as indeed many of my colleagues did. Before she went, she decided to do one guy from every department - customer services, sales, finance, claims, complaints, fraud, admin, compliance, IT, security... you get the idea... She managed it, too. Took her 3 weeks to get all the way round.

Guy on my team hooked up with a woman on the next team over. Then felt the need to tell us all the kinky stuff she made him do. At least they were happy.

"Lucie". Gay. Straight. Gay. No, straight. Nah... prefer gay... STRAIGHT! I'm getting married! Gay. Gay. Gay. Straight.

One manager was doing her superior. Both were a pair of cunts. She even slept with him the night before her wedding to the father of her children.

Three guys on my team were after this one girl. Then she hit on me. I took great pleasure in telling the boys about that. They didn't bother asking for photos...

And as for me? I learned my lesson about getting involved with workmates a long time ago.

In my 4 years, I was asked out by 16 different men (and two women). All politely declined... except that serial father... he was told to go fuck himself with a stick...

Saturday, 30 July 2011

True hero

On Tuesday morning, a lorry caught fire in the Brynglas Tunnels on the M4 at Newport. It caused hours of traffic jams and disruption as the tunnel had to be closed.

Meet Ashley Hall.

That's him up there.

He was driving behind the lorry as it became engulfed in flames. The lorry driver had stopped and got out but was in severe shock and attempted to get back in his truck. Ashley stopped his car and ordered the lorry driver to get in before driving out of the tunnel, seconds before the truck exploded.

His actions most definitely saved the lorry driver's life.

I had to drive through the tunnel today on my way back from Herefordshire. There is a 30 mile an hour speed limit in place in the tunnel (50 leading to it). The traffic jams to get in was absolutely horrendous.

Know why?

Because everyone was slowing down to look at the damage.

Clever.

The tarmac in the tunnel melted so they have done a temporary resurface until they can get in and finish the job properly. The rest of the damage is incredible, though.

There is serious damage to the roof of the tunnel with the lights knocked out for part of the way and you can see the smoke damage all over the place. It was downright eerie to drive through it.

When I was living in LA, I came home to visit my mom in Newport at Christmas. One Sunday lunch time, we were in the kitchen when we noticed thick black smoke coming from a few blocks away. We decided to go out and investigate and while we were walking towards the focus, there were four large explosions. Of course, I lived in LA and this wasn't long after 9/11... Mom told me to get up from behind the car I was using as a shield as it was obviously tyres exploding...

We made our way to the local bakery where a truck was ablaze. The fire quickly spread and burnt down a large part of the adjacent buildings.

It was one of the scariest things I had ever witnessed. This was out in the open so I can only imagine how bad it must have been in the tunnel...

The fire brigade were there for days, damping down. Then there was a fire at the aluminium factory a few days later...

What a Christmas for those men. We all took them chocolates and cakes to cheer them up.

The cause of the tunnel fire is under investigation.

The bakery fire?

Arson.

The kid later burned down the local school too. We had a fun evening watching that burn with the neighbours too...

Life in a call centre, Part 1

Four years.

FOUR YEARS.

I was young and full of hope when I started there...

Fuckers.

Do you know how they thanked me for my years of loyal service? They "forgot" to pay me my last wage. Payroll told me my line manager had not sent over the correct paperwork so now I sit here, owed about £1400. They couldn't deal with it yesterday. No one works Fridays, you see...

The rule was that you could not have a relationship with anyone over whom who held influence or power. So why were three of the managers shagging frontline staff on their own teams and one manager was doing a higher manager who was responsible for her promotion?

Targets. We had many targets. I caught several top sellers actively miss-selling. I reported it. I was told to keep quiet. I was only ever a mediocre seller. I sleep well at night.

We always knew when we were getting fucked over; we'd get free tea and coffee and the top managers would hand out cakes. They did that before the redundancies, before they cut our pensions, before they reduced our incentives, before they raised our targets. Some of the lads got VERY chunky in their time there...

Speaking of which... working in a call centre is horrendous for your health. The air-con was dodgy as hell so we were always sick and you were not encouraged to leave your pod. When I was transferred to another department, I dropped 16lbs in 2 weeks... but then I was happy for the first time in years at that place...

They hated graduates. That was one of the reasons given for me never getting promoted. "Graduates know how to say the right thing and then they leave". Wanna know why we leave? Because of attitudes like that.

My line manager would regularly discuss my personal information and performance with other team members.

My manager was a complete cunt.

And she was dirty.

She once asked one of my team mates to call the DVLA and pretend to be her son. He declined. BECAUSE THAT IS FRAUD!

She obviously does not recall her FSA/Data Protection training.

On my last day, her goodbye? "Humph".

Yeah, fuck you too, you painted trollop.

Happy (Belated) Birthday!

Yesterday was Geddy's 58th birthday. I DID NOT FORGET!! I merely forgot to blog it...

In my defence, I spent most of the day on the phone to the Payroll department of my previous company after the fuckers chose not to pay me my settlement. This is now being paid next week but the extra crap meant I forgot what is actually important - praising Geddy.

Friday, 29 July 2011

Bad ebayers!

This is a work in progress - feel free to add your own nominations in the comments section...

69baillie - sent me a mouldy, stained handbag and then sent a series of very threatening emails after I complained
allpolishedupnails - lists stuff they do not have available for sale
bablecat - did a charge back after receiving item (via credit card company)
cdshackuk - shill bidder
chelsea-jan1970 - sells fake designer jewellery
chocolatebabe10 - sends repeated obscenely low offers on BIN listings with Best Offer
chrissage - sent repeated threatening emails to me when was not happy with a purchase and refused to return item (coincidently, also a gossip that spread malicious lies about my personal life amongst mutual friends)
cocopoppooh - makes repeated unreasonably low offers on BIN listings with Best Offer feature
cwrt40 - shill bidder
daisyleaf31 - did not send item and refused to communicate
eil_espirit - uses ebay to build up their own marketing list and refuses to resolve issues
fabgearuk - bullied and harassed me into giving a refund whilst refusing to return an item. Had to open a dispute against them to get payment in the first place
fabiocum - shill bidder
flamingo-sans-designs - makes best offers but with terms added that they will only pay under certain circumstances (ie, "if I get paid next week, I will pay you", etc)
grant0303dog - non-paying bidder
heart-trending - steals photos
jimmyjaytroy - non-paying bidder
karen161164 - shill bidder
liam78models - did not send item, in fact emailed to say was not going to bother sending it!
mk11-2009 - shill bidder
motorkent - non-paying bidder
nicholasbenham - non-paying bidder
philloppotoro - refused to combine postage so made more than 100% profit on P&P. Ignored three emails I sent. Described a tatty old item as "good" when pages were torn out, etc
prettyvacantink - selling broken jewellery as "vintage, like new"
sally4334 - rather than resolving issues (an item she sent me did not arrive), goes psycho and accusing regular customers of lying
silky_smooth_tvt - selling fake Tatty Devine
stonedranger67 - non-paying bidder
topsales45 - pulls listing if they are not making enough and then lies as to why
tops-hair-salon - really rude "terms" about how they will harass you if you are unhappy with the transaction

Oh and my bad ebayer list is so long due to the number of transactions I have been a part of. This is out of 4000-odd. Not that many in the grand scheme of things...

Thursday, 28 July 2011

So kept a little quiet about this...

I had an interview Monday to work at a law firm in Cardiff. The pay was OK but it is an entry-level position so it kinda sucked, considering my education and experience and all...

But anyway... On Monday, I was getting ready for the interview (which mainly consists of me telling my contacts to "GET IN MY FUCKING EYE YOU BASTARDS!") when my mobile rang. I was only half paying attention but it was a woman asking me to interview for a temporary position in a local call centre. I was thinking of a way to politely decline when she said it was as a complaints handler...

I absolutely loved working in the complaints department at my last place and really miss that aspect of the job. So now I was listening... She said she would email me some details so I could have a look through and see if I wanted to apply.

I went off to the interview with the law firm, got home, read the info pack I had been sent and thought OK... not bad... She then called me back and invited me to interview. In Reading. I went today. £100 that train ticket cost me...

Yes, I got the job. It is working at a company I always wanted to work for doing something I love doing. OK, it is only for 6 months but the pay is three times what I was on at my last place. Also, they said they will be happy to place me elsewhere after I relocate back to the West Midlands.

So it has worked out quite well for me.

The hours are a bit anti-social but for that amount of money, I am hardly going to argue...

I start in ten days so I am going to enjoy what is left of my holiday time and get ready to make some cash.

Oh yeah.

And yes, there is a recommend a friend programme so if any of my current readers are looking for work, let me know...

Sunday, 24 July 2011

People are so easy to con...

...and seem to enjoy blindly following others without questioning what is actually going on.

Yesterday, I posted about a Facebook group that had been set up and I said I thought it had been set up by a man due to the terms used.

Well, the admin announced that their name was Karin Fien and we could find out all about her if we "looked her up". Of course, we did and we quickly found some very offensive web pages about her, accusing her of all sorts of sexual depravity and child neglect, amongst other things.

The admin of the Facebook group spent the entire day being vile until a rival group was set up, attacking her and a blog appeared with all sorts of alleged details about her shared.

I will admit that the group admin had got me really angry and I got caught up in all of the hatred initially.

But then it dawned on me... I truly felt that the initial Facebook group had been set up by a man due to the misogynistic terms used. They had been pretty offensive in the morning but in the afternoon their tone and content changed dramatically (to the point where I thought it was a teenage boy in the morning and a very well educated man in the afternoon). The terms used throughout suggested it was a male who was behind the page anyway. The admin created a Facebook profile for Karin Fien after we started questioning their identity. As soon as people started running with all the hatred about Karin Fien, the admin stopped posting (because they no longer needed to; the damage was already done). As soon as the anti-Karin group was set up, loads of her "victims" came out of the woodwork and joined.

Add to that the fact that the admin told us to go looking for Karin Fien online, knowing full well the abuse we would find...

And the really strange thing? There is no actual physical proof of anything this woman has done; it is all stuff that has been posted by others.

It is just too well-organised.

OK, she may be a psycho but I don't think she is this particular psycho.

I believe that this Facebook group, along with others alleged to have been in her name was set up by an enemy of hers. She is a well-known cougar (she did an interview in the Daily Mail) and we all know how intensely immature younger men can be... I am under the impression that this has been "masterminded" (ha!) by an ex-boyfriend who has a vendetta against her.

It is all too easy for it to have been this woman. And if you google her and see some of the abuse recorded about her online, you will see that someone obviously has real issues with her and a half-assed attempt to cause a Facebook row is not beyond the capabilities of even the most stupid man...

Again, this Karin may be an absolute nutjob but the fact that one person admitted to harassing her disabled teenage daughter suggests there are worse nutjobs to be concerned about right now...

**Quick edit**

My theories have been confirmed. Another anti-Karin group has been set up and when someone brought my post to the group's attention, the attitude was very much "who cares? Let's get the slag, etc".

I believe it is two men behind the fake profiles - one is a slightly stupid young man who likes calling complete strangers "cunt" and another is slightly better spoken and tries to use semi-rational argument to piss everyone off. If I cared, I would name the two males but it is so incredibly obvious, even the most naive person would see it...

And all the anti-Karin arguments? Well, they pretty much focus on her weight or on the fact that her daughter is disabled. THAT is immature.

Some daft woman has claimed that I - Irezumi Muzan - am Karin! HAHAHAHA!!! What an absolute fuckwit! I have been here since '07 and I am very well-known in my own right. Is she really so stupid to think that Karin would spend years cultivating a blog like this to just use it to defend herself at a later date? No. I am a well-educated woman that can see when people are being scammed.

Oh and I tried to rejoin the first anti-Karin group to point out the error of their ways but my request was blocked, purely because I was showing them how wrong they were on here! Talk about open-minded...

I hope Karin sues the bloody lot of them.

**Edit 2**

Oh and now the admin has reappeared, claiming to be Karin again after I posted this. Come on, you can't all be THAT thick??? Why would she feel the need to state that she is Karin in that way? Jeez, this is like trying to explain Astrophysics to a 3 year old...

**Edit 3**

For the terminally dull, a hint as to who one of the perpetrators behind the fake accounts is... the other night "Karin" referred to someone as a "mong". Firstly, I can guarantee she would not use that term, considering what has happened to her daughter. Secondly, who has been using that term rather a lot recently? Yup? Got it now? Good.

eil.com are just shit

I made the mistake of buying a record from them on ebay at the start of the week. It was quite a rare one so I was happy to have been able to find it.

I then received an email from Sophie at eil.com to say the record had been shipped and

As we're such nice people here at eil.com and genuinely appreciate your first
order, we've given you a credit on your account to the value of £ 5.00 which
you can use against your next order. There are absolutely no catches!! All
you have to do now is make the difficult decision as to which items you are
going to purchase next! Credit will automatically be deducted from your next
order at the checkout stage on our web site or will be deducted by our sales
team if you order by telephone or email.

OK, I thought... I had a browse through and selected a couple of press packs that I wouldn't mind adding to my collection. The £5 off would basically cover the postage. So I went through the order process and GUESS WHAT! The £5 was never deducted!

I thought that was a bit odd so I emailed this Sophie and asked what their game was (though I, of course, worded it very politely).

GUESS WHAT!

No response.

By this point, I had already paid for the press packs (about £60). I was kinda livid. OK, it was only a fiver but that strikes me as being very false advertising...

Anyway, after ordering my press packs, I went through and selected that I did not want any marketing at all (which took me practically FOREVER because they feel the need to add you to a shit load of email lists). I very carefully went through it and saved it. So no marketing.

No?

Like fuck.

I got an emailed Black Sabbath list through from a Joe at eil.com. I emailed back to ask why I had received it when I had specifically requested no marketing.

I got this email in response -

After investigating this further i can see that your account was NOT flagged for no mailouts. It has now been done so.

So I wasted all that time suppressing marketing for fuck all?!!

This company are a joke. They wont give me the fiver they owe me (again, principle!) and their own marketing suppression form does not even work!

Guess who will be getting negative feedback on ebay then. Shit customer service does not make up for decent rare records...

*****Quick edit*****

They just phoned me and made it clear they had no intention of resolving this issue! What a bunch of tossers!

Poor old Gino

Coco pushes him around so much but then Gino lets him...

Saturday, 23 July 2011

RIP Amy Winehouse


Amy Winehouse had immense talent but it was just wasted due to her addictions.

I hope she is at peace.

Friday, 22 July 2011

Facebook = Fucktard Heaven

I just happened to stumble upon this Facebook page -

For those that don't know, here is an article with details of the case. Basically, someone contaminated saline with insulin in a hospital and 5 patients have died. Rebecca Leighton is a nurse at the hospital and is being questioned. Questioned. She has not yet been charged (as of 9:42 am on 22nd July 2011).

So some clever little soul has decided to set up the above Facebook page calling her a "Murdering Whore". The tag line is "This woman must've done something wrong to get arrested in the first place!!!"

What a fucking moron.

So there is no such thing as innocent until proven guilty any longer.

Wonderful.

Now I am not saying she is innocent. I am also not saying she is guilty. I have not seen the evidence so I cannot judge. No one else should either.

What gives this little Facebook troll the right to post such crap about her?

I bet he's the sort of weirdo that gets a stiffy every time he reads about a rape victim being stoned to death in Iran.

Again, she may be guilty but how many people are questioned and then are not charged? The British legal system is not perfect.

(Though I can GUARANTEE that is she is charged and it goes to trial, the lawyers will argue Münchhausen Syndrome by Proxy and she'll spend the rest of her days in a secure hospital.)

We simply cannot allow trial by Facebook. What next? Cut off the hands of suspected thieves?

Ignorance cannot win.

Thursday, 21 July 2011

I am not a Brummie...

video

Sorry for the bad quality... trying to work out how my camera works. Only owned it for two and a half fucking years...

Wednesday, 20 July 2011

Our house, in the middle of our street

Ah, my neighbours...

Wankers.

The guy next door has decided he does not like my cats and now does not want them anywhere near his property. Have you ever tried training a cat? He decided this because we objected to him trying to dig up the foundations of our house. He has so far encroached onto out property by 3 feet at the front with his driveway and wall and he keeps digging up our flower beds. When we objected, he suddenly did not like cats...

There's the guy up the road who moved in sometime in the 1980s after his folks bought him the house. It is stuffed wall to wall with old newspapers. There's a bookcase blocking one window that has been there since the day he moved in. He only leaves the house to mow the lawns at the local church.

Know what I think?

Serial killer.

The woman over the road and up one has that psycho dog that broke my mother's hand a couple of years ago and keeps going for me. She wont muzzle it and the local police are not interested.

The woman over the road and down one often stands on the doorstep early in the morning screaming "You fat twat!" at her live-in boyfriend when he leaves to play golf.

So classy.

Two doors up from us, the woman who gets lonely so calls 999 three times a week and says she thinks she is dying because "that nice ambulance lady always makes me a cup of tea".

Two doors down? Convicted paedophile.

Three doors down is the lovely woman who decided that she was tired of having an affair so she stabbed her husband - he survived - and moved her lover in (and the husband's property out) while he was recovering in the hospital.

Over the road and down two is the weird woman who only lets her adult sons out at 7pm to go to the local shop and they have to be back by 7:15 or she calls the police. All on the dole.

Top of the road - THEM. Violent parents and badly behaved children that have been expelled from more schools than you could imagine. The youngest was banned from Brownies at age 6 for racially abusing a young Asian girl. The kids are all barred from the local shops for stealing. He weighs a good 30 stone and thinks all women fancy him (try ya luck with me, ya cunt!) and she is a chain-smoking ex-prostitute.

And we live out in the country! That's the annoying thing... When I lived in Birmingham, we expected this kind of stuff but not down in South Wales.

The entire family have decided to move back to the West Midlands for the safety and protection of the children. I have my eye on a little cottage just outside Stanford Bridge in Worcestershire. Mom is looking at Kidderminster. My sister is looking at a renovation project in Hereford.

I will always be proud to be Welsh but the country has just gone to shit.

Bad mother...

I went to school with this girl. She was a bit of a strange one... There were issues with her mother so her and her sister lived with her grandmother. She never shaved her legs and never wore a bra (needed to on both counts). She went a bit more funny towards the end of year 9 and I stopped talking to her. She eventually dropped out of school and disappeared.

Last year, I joined Facebook at the urging of the kids and she was one of the first to add me. She did the usual "You look fabulous! Missed you! We should catch up!" bollocks and that was that.

Through reading her updates, I could see that she had two kids with a bloke but they had broken up as he treated her badly and were going through a messy custody battle but she currently had the kids and was living with her new bloke.

Then she won full custody of the kids and started planning a wedding with the new man.

Great! Good for her to be finally settled.

Then she gets pregnant with her new man. At that point, she does what any good mother would do... she surrendered custody of her two older children to her violent ex... WHAT THE FUCK?!!

OK. Maybe there is stuff going on that we don't know about.

Then she had the baby a fortnight ago. She's not breastfeeding, even with all the latest research on the matter showing that it is best for the health of the baby. But I digress... Within days, she was posting that she needed a night out with the girls as she needed a break from the newborn. Then there were the updates from the spa and the tanning salon... Then the night out with the girls when she did not get back til 10am the next morning...

Am I being daft or something? I thought that when you had a baby, the child became your number one priority and you certainly did not leave the baby with others while you went out and got pissed. Evidently things have changed...

Because of a few of my status updates in which I questioned her abilities as a mother, she has now started posting that her baby means the world to her and they will be spending the day at the hospital today because the baby isn't well. I'm not surprised the baby isn't well when the mother is a neglectful alcoholic.

This is the same woman who allows her 8 year old to go on her at-home sunbed (remember the big ones from the 80s when everyone was ignorant to the dangers? Yeah, one of them...).

So... Social Services? I think so...

Fucking ebay

It just never gets better with them!

I absolutely hate the current feedback system (see my previous post) but the DSR rankings are beginning to piss me off even more.

Basically, when a buyer purchases something from you, they mark you out of 5 for Item as described, communication, dispatch time, and postage costs.

I am currently rated 4.85, 4.87, 4.96 and 5.00 respectively.

Not bad... until you look at it closer...

For item as described, one person gave me a 1 out of 5 and I have received a formal warning from ebay about this. Two more and limits will be placed on my account. The thing is, the person did not email me to say there was a problem (I will resolve all issues in a timely manner) and what could have been that bad? To be rated 1, the item has to be either counterfeit (I don't deal in fakes) or broken. Surely if it was broken, the buyer would have contacted me? Also, this buyer rated me 1 and yet still left me a positive feedback. This is actually supposed to be against ebay's rules so why wasn't the person pulled up on this?

Communication at 4.87. When I send an item, I send each buyer a personal email explaining the item is on the way and how long they should expect before they receive it. Is this not good enough? Evidently not for some...

Dispatch time - 4.96. Most items are mailed the same day of purchase or the following working day (or Saturday) at the very latest. Again, this is not quick enough? I have had to wait weeks for items before now and have not felt the need to mark sellers down. It especially galls me when some buyers take days to pay and then blame me for them not receiving their item quicker. Sucks.

And I get 5.00 for postage charges because, with the exception of the odd international listing, all of my items have free postage so ebay automatically give me 5 stars every time someone leaves me feedback.

I feel that if ebay really thinks this rating system is a good idea, they should have clear guidelines on how to use it for buyers with an explanation of the consequences of leaving false harsh ratings. Because of the way some people have marked me, I do not come up near the top in many ebay searches. I am, however, rated as an above average ebay seller.

What do they expect of me though???

Tuesday, 19 July 2011

Meet my brand new Glenn Tipton tattoo!

...and if you say it is someone different, imma fuck you up...

Lissimore v Downing (2003)

The geeky, boring criminologist in me is taking over again on this one. Sorry! When this case was reported in The Sun in 2003, my then-lover (a musician) sent me the story as a warning...

What a romantic guy he was!

It is one of those that has always stuck with me for various reasons but it is now pretty much reduced to a few lines and the odd newspaper article on a google search.

Today, however, I spent a good hour reading the judgement in the case and thought it was about time someone did a proper summary of it. Here goes!

*****

The Sun
February 8, 2003

JUDITH PRIEST

Andrew Parker

Rocker 'wanted wedding dress'

JUDAS Priest rocker Ken Downing shocked his lover by announcing he wanted to put on a wedding dress, a court was told.

The veteran heavy metal guitarist made the bizarre demand after he spotted a bride in a restaurant.

His girlfriend Julie was dumbstruck and the pair later split. The story was told by the woman who took Julie's place -and is now suing Downing, 52, for a share of his fortune after he ditched her.


Sarah Lissimore, 35, said: "Ken told me he and Julie had stopped talking after he told her he'd like to try a bride's dress on. He said they were in a restaurant together and she went dead silent."

Sarah said she fell for Downing -KK to his fans -ten years ago.

She claimed she quit a promising career in pharmacy to live with him at his Pounds 2million Shropshire estate, Astbury Hall.

Sarah said he bought her an Argos engagement ring and asked her to wear it on her wedding finger.

When the affair collapsed, she demanded a cash settlement -but Downing offered her a tank of petrol for her car. She told Birmingham County Court: "He said he'd give me a tank of fuel and that was it. I was shocked."

Sarah said she had run the estate while Downing toured with Judas Priest, whose hit albums include Screaming For Vengeance.

She claimed she is entitled to part of his fortune for investing "time and skill" in Astbury instead of her own career -and is now skint.

Downing insisted the ring he gave Sarah was not an engagement band.

He said: "She knew before she came to Astbury I didn't want to marry."

Downing added: "Everything I do and every penny I have goes on the estate -it is my passion, my pension and my life."

He said the idea he'd share Astbury was "insulting". The case continues.


*****


Sarah Lissimore was 25 and estranged from her husband (though they were still living together) when she met 41 year old Kenneth "KK" Downing in a pub one night (in Autumn 1993) whilst she was out with a friend on one of those "We hate men" evenings that we all do... some of us more than others... She thought he was a farmer when she first started seeing him. Good for him.

They hit it off and she quickly moved into his house, Astbury Hall, a property Downing had bought in 1985, followed by surrounding farmland in 1991 with the intention of turning it into a golf course. She did not tell her parents for three months... Good start to the relationship there! She said she intended to buy a flat with her divorce settlement but he didn't like the area because it was rough and he didn't want his brand new Range Rover vandalised. Fair enough. Downing told Lissimore from the start that it would not be a conventional relationship; after-all, she was still legally married, though her divorce would be final in July 1994. While Judas Priest was basically on hiatus after Rob's departure, he must have known he would return to being a touring musician at some point and he confirmed that theirs would be an open relationship.

KK had also had a series of relationships that did not end well - he lived with Carole until 1985 (she had supported him in the early days and when they broke up, he paid off their mortgage and gave her the house), then Kyme who worked as a jeweller to support herself and lived with him in Spain... she returned to the US to be an actress in the 1980s after having an affair with another musician and was killed in a car accident in the early 1990s, and finally Julie who worked as a flight attendant; their relationship ended after she said she wanted to get married and KK said he would like to wear the wedding dress...

There's a pattern emerging... These women in KK's life all worked and did not demand much of him (aside from the odd marriage proposal). In return, they got his attention and support when the relationships ended (he partially financed Kyme's return to California, buying her an apartment).
____________________________
For the sake of accuracy, Kyme Hoan Tran was born in Vietnam on 30th June 1960 and was living in Woodland Hills when she was killed on January 17th 1993. The original report from the LA Times -

1 Driver Dies, 2nd Critically Hurt

January 18, 1993

A traffic accident on a rain-slicked Studio City street Sunday left one woman dead and another critically injured, Los Angeles police said.

A car driven by a woman heading south on Laurel Canyon Boulevard near Fryman Road spun out at high speed and crashed head-on with an oncoming car about 4:30 p.m., Officer Dave Cueto said.

____________________________
She was 32. Kyme is buried at Forest Lawn Memorial-Park in the Hollywood Hills. Her obituary -

Daily News of Los Angeles (CA) - January 22, 1993

Deceased Name: Tran, Kyme H.
Tran, Kyme H., 32, of Woodland Hills, self-employed jewelry salesman. Services will be at 2:30 p.m. Monday in the Old North Church at Forest Lawn Memorial-Park and Mortuary, Hollywood Hills. Private burial.

_____________________________
Then there's this woman. Sarah Lissimore was a pharmacy assistant when she met him and continued to work at this job, firstly full-time and then part-time before giving up work altogether. She claimed he forced her to give up work as her being out of the house inconvenienced him. He claimed he told her she could give up work if she wanted to as she wouldn't stop complaining about how much she hated the job. He agreed to support her until her divorce settlement came through, though he did suggest she could take a job closer to the house or do a computer course to improve her skills. She claims she was offered a sales job for a pharmaceutical company (there is no evidence to confirm this, aside from the statement of a relative of hers). She never took another job.

KK did continue to support her through the years, paying her credit card bill, putting money in her bank account, plus - of course - he paid all expenses relating to the home. She chose to spend her divorce settlement on a new car (she claims he told her she had to buy it) plus other things rather than investing it. Her choice.

Over the years, Lissimore took care of the house (in that she would discuss things with the staff who would then report back to KK for the go-ahead or paint the odd door or plant the odd flower-bed) while he recorded and toured. It is interesting to note that he did a lot of the cooking...

Then things changed.

Lissimore wanted to get married and have children. When KK bought her a £400 ring from Argos for Christmas 1994, she told everyone they were engaged. He did not deny it publicly so as not to embarrass her but privately he made it clear there was to be no wedding. He had also made it clear from the start that he would never want children as he would have to undergo medical treatment prior to conception being able to occur. She claims he was emotionally abusive and when she had tried to leave, he had offered her a tank of petrol.

In December 2001, Lissimore decided she had had enough and secretly filed a legal claim for half-ownership of Astbury Hall and Downing's properties in Spain, demanding that they be sold immediately. Downing was on tour at the time. She was also still living in the house but did move to another wing.

KK was very hurt by this as it was his house and he never intended to share it with anyone; he had even consulted a lawyer when she moved in to ensure she would have no claims on his property and was given general advise about protecting himself.

Downing and his lawyer decided to fight it.

It reached court in 2003.

The case disintegrated very quickly, with her claims against the Spanish properties dropped first, followed by her claim for half of Astbury Hall (worth over £2 million) in favour of a cash settlement of £200,000 so she could buy her own house and cover expenses until she was working again.

Her whole claim revolved around the fact that when they first got together, he referred to her as the "Lady of the Manor", amongst other things. She claimed that he would talk down to her about how she should not trouble her "pretty little head" with financial issues and would always take care of her. He denied that and the judge sided with him. She also believed that the fact that he included her in his will gave her claims on his property. He also included his mother, brother and two sisters. Doesn't mean any of them actually own his house and can demand he sell it.

Funnily enough, throughout the relationship, Lissimore never once claimed any part-ownership of the properties and only decided to do so when she wanted to leave.

Now I ain't saying she a gold-digger...

During the case, Downing's lawyer lodged a request to stop Lissimore from publishing documents she had photocopied while KK was away on that final tour before she filed. The content of the documents was not made public but the judge did confirm that she had no need to copy these documents and therefore could not publish the content.

Then there were the tapes. After KK found out what she was trying to do, he confronted her in her wing of the house and was "verbally abusive" towards her. She claimed she then feared domestic abuse and started recording all conversations that took place in her rooms. The only thing revealed in these tapes was the suggestion that she was trying to get a media deal out of the break-up. Downing eventually removed the tape recorder from Lissimore's possession during a violent incident. The content of the tapes has never been released.

Finally, KK also wanted details of his personal life kept private and was concerned that she would be trying to do tell-all story on his life. KK did not say specifically what he wanted kept private but during proceedings did admit to being bi-sexual, that he had had an affair with a pre-op transsexual man, and that he had an interest in cross-dressing. This was all recorded in court records but nothing ever came of it.

As for the final judgement? Her entire case was proven to be unfounded and she was instructed to pay court costs, sources say running at close to £100,000.

Sarah Lissimore was declared bankrupt the following year.

Kenneth "KK" Downing got his golf course.

So what do we learn from this case?

No matter how rich he is, how serious you think the relationship is... never give up your independence. Whether he's a rock star or a bin man, you keep your own income, own bank account, own property. If he marries you, THEN you can relax. Until then, expect nothing because, more than likely, that's exactly what you'll end up with.

Happy Birthday Brian!

Brian May is 64 today!

Monday, 18 July 2011

Dave Holland

Follows a series of news articles from when the story broke with my take on the situation after...

The News of the World
January 26, 2003

JUDAS PRIEST DRUMMER IN 'RAPE' PROBE

Lucy Panton

JUDAS Priest drummer Dave Holland has been arrested over claims that he carried out a sex attack on a wheelchair-bound teenager.

The flamboyant 54-year-old rock star was quizzed over allegations involving a 17-year-old disabled boy he was teaching to play the drums.


The boy, who cannot be identified for legal reasons, is understood to have a mental age of only eight or nine.

Holland was arrested by police at his home on the outskirts of Daventry village in Northamptonshire.

He was taken to Weston Flavell police station in Northampton and questioned about rape and gross indecency allegations.

He was later released on police bail pending further inquiries.

Heavy rock band Judas Priest was formed in Birmingham in the 1970s.

The group had several Top 20 hits in the 1980s with songs including Breaking the Law. Living after Midnight and British Steel.

In the early 1990s the controversial band was accused of inciting suicide by including "subliminal" messages on records but was cleared by a court in 1993.

The group reformed with new lead singer Tim Owens in 1996.

Holland, who was born and brought up in Northampton, now runs a drum kit shop in the town and is a familiar figure on the local music scene.

February 23, 2003

CORRECTION: FOLLOWING our January 26 article about former Judas Priest drummer, Dave Holland, being arrested on suspicion of a sex attack, we have been asked to make it clear that he left Judas Priest 14 years ago and has had no connection with the band since then.


*****


Daily Star
May 13, 2003

ROCK STAR IN RAPE RAP

JUDAS PRIEST rock drummer Dave Holland
appeared in court yesterday accused of carrying out a sex attack on a wheelchair-bound teenage boy.

He is charged with indecent assault and raping the teenager, who is believed to have a mental age of eight or nine.

Holland and assault co-accused Spiros Laoutaris, both of Northants, will appear at Northampton Crown Court on May 20.


*****


Birmingham Evening Mail
January 14, 2004

ROCKER IN SEX TRIAL CHARGED

A FORMER drummer with Birmingham rock band Judas Priest was going on trial today accused of sexual assaults against a 17year-old boy.

David Holland faces one charge of attempted rape and four of indecent assault on the teenager.

All are said to have taken place between July and December 2002.

Holland, 55, of Stoke Bruerne, Northants, denied all the charges when he last appeared in court in Leicester in August.

He was granted unconditional bail to appear at Northampton Crown Court today.

Co-accused Spiros Laoutaris, 22, of Kings Heath, Northampton, faces four separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager over the same period.

Holland joined Judas Priest in 1979 and played with the band for the next 10 years in their heyday.

The Brummie rockers reached number 12 in the British charts in 1980 with two records, Living After Midnight and Breaking TheLaw. They had several other top 20 hits but never reached the top 10 in the UK. Holland is still involved in the local music scene.


*****


Press Association
January 15, 2004

EX-JUDAS PRIEST DRUMMER DENIES SEX CHARGES

Andrew Barrow

A former drummer with rock band Judas Priest sexually assaulted a teenage boy a number of times while the special needs youngster was visiting his house for drum lessons, a court was told today.

Drummer David Holland faces one charge of attempted rape and five counts of indecent assault on the teenager.

All of the alleged offences are said to have taken place between June and December 2002.

Holland's co-accused, Spiros Laouitaris, 22, faces four separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager.


Holland, 55, of The Green, Stoke Bruerne, Northants, and Laouitaris, of Bourne Crescent, Kings Heath, Northampton, deny all the charges.

Opening the prosecution case at Northampton Crown Court today, Maria Savvides told the jury of seven women and five man that the accusations came to light in December 2002 when the teenager, who is now 18 but cannot be named for legal reasons, told his parents in a letter of his abuse while staying at Holland's house for drum lessons.

Miss Savvides said that the boy's parents had encouraged the drum lessons in order to improve their son's self-esteem.

Because of the growing relationship between teacher and pupil, they had allowed their son to stay over at his home on a number of occasions.

Counsel added: "It (the letter) revealed that things were happening at his drum teacher's house that shouldn't have been happening.

"In about the spring of 2002 he started to visit the defendant's home in Stoke Bruerne. What (the teenager) says is that he went to his teacher's house.

"He was asked to go upstairs and take a shower. He came downstairs and was forced to participate in oral sex. The defendant performed oral sex on him and the defendant forced (the teenager) to perform oral sex on him."

The teenager gave a video statement to police in which he outlined the assaults and the attempted rape during the seven months he visited Holland's house. He also alleged that Laouitaris joined in assaults and forced him to perform assaults during the same period.

The jury was being shown the video evidence today.

The trial, before Judge Charles Wide QC, heard that the teenager had suffered problems at school from an early age and took part in a number of activities to improve his learning difficulties.

Miss Savvides said: "The complainant is a young lad who from an early age had experienced problems and learning difficulties. His parents were at great pains to find activities that would help him with his own self esteem. Drum lessons was something he could do and that he was happy with."

Holland joined Judas Priest in 1979 and played with them for the next 10 years in their heyday.

The Birmingham-based band reached Number 12 in the British charts in 1980 with two records, Living After Midnight and Breaking The Law.

They had several other Top 20 hits but never reached the Top 10 in the UK.

Holland was born in Northampton and is still involved in the local music scene.

She told the jury: "He didn't allow it to happen. You will hear about him moving away and finding a warm corner in the room."

Holland, wearing a green shirt and brown leather jacket, sat alongside Laouitaris in the dock as the jury was later shown the teenager's video statement recorded on December 17, 2002.

Referring to the rock drummer as "Dave", the boy described how the assaults started at Holland's cottage some six months after he began having lessons, initially at a drum shop in the centre of Northampton.

"The first time I went round to his cottage, it was right at the start of the summer holidays," the teenager said.

"He invited me."

The teenager said he felt "uncomfortable" when Holland tried to perform a sex act on him. He added: "I don't know if he does it to anyone else but he does it to me."

The trial was adjourned until tomorrow.


*****


Press Association
January 16, 2004

EX-ROCK DRUMMER 'SEXUALLY ABUSED MUSIC LESSONS TEENAGER' JURY TOLD

Andrew Barrow

A teenage boy with learning difficulties became aggressive towards his parents and scared to be alone after he was sexually abused by a former rock drummer, a court heard today.

David Holland, who once played with rock band Judas Priest, is accused of sexually assaulting the 17-year-old a number of times while the special needs youngster was visiting his house for drum lessons.

Holland faces one charge of attempted rape and five counts of indecent assault on the teenager. All the alleged offences are said to have taken place between June and December 2002.


Holland's co-accused, Spiros Laouitaris, 22, faces four separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager.

Holland, 55, of The Green, Stoke Bruerne, Northants, and Laouitaris, of Bourne Crescent, Kings Heath, Northampton, deny all the charges.

The court has heard that the teenager's parents organised the music lessons to try to boost his self esteem.

But in evidence today, the boy's father said his son's manner changed after he started visiting Holland's cottage in the Northamptonshire village.

"For us it was a very emotional time," he said. "He was very disturbed, really aggressive and mixed up. We noticed it.

"During the time he was going to Dave's we noted he was getting blotches on his arms, towards the end, the last few lessons.

"About the last time he went to Dave's he started to have baths every day. He doesn't like having baths.

"He didn't want us to go out. One of us had to stay with him. We would sit up on his bed and watch videos. He just clung to us, he was really disturbed."

More recently, after leaving college, his parents had found him a Saturday job from which he went full-time.

"He has been able to feel better and achieve, so he has come on a long way in this last year," the father said.

The jury of seven women and five men at Northampton Crown Court heard that the alleged offences came to light in December 2002 when the teenager, who is now 18 but who cannot be named for legal reasons, told his parents in a letter of the abuse while staying at Holland's house for drum lessons.

In a video statement to police he outlined the assaults and the attempted rape during the seven months he visited Holland's house.

He also alleged that Laouitaris joined in assaults and forced him to perform sex acts during the same period.

Maria Savvides, prosecuting, told the jury on Thursday that the boy had managed to stop Holland from raping him but had been abused in other ways, with the drummer using a sex toy on him on one occasion.

Holland joined Birmingham-based Judas Priest in 1979 and played with them for the next 10 years during which they had several Top 20 hits but never reached the Top 10.

The hearing was adjourned until Monday.


*****


Press Association
January 19, 2004

ATTEMPTED RAPE CHARGE IS RIDICULOUS, SAYS DRUMMER

Andrew Barrow

A former rock star accused of attempting to rape a special needs youngster while giving drum lessons at his rural home denied the accusations today, saying the charges were "ridiculous".

David Holland, the former drummer of rock band Judas Priest, faces one charge of attempted rape and five counts of indecent assault on the teenage boy. All the alleged offences are said to have taken place between June and December 2002.

Holland's co-accused, Spiros Laouitaris, 22, faces four separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager.


Holland, 55, of The Green, Stoke Bruerne, Northants, and Laouitaris, of Bourne Crescent, Kings Heath, Northampton, deny all the charges.

Giving evidence at Northampton Crown Court today, Holland said he had formed a "friendship" with the teenager, who is aged 18 but cannot be named for legal reasons, and had invited him to his house on several occasions. The drummer stressed that no sexual advances were made towards the teenager.

Under examination by defence counsel Michael Joyce, Holland said the teenager was allowed to drink and smoke at his house and watch videos. He admitted owning pornographic films and sex toys but denied he had ever shown them to the boy.

Asked by Mr Joyce if he had ever shown the boy pornographic films or a vibrator he kept in the house, Holland replied: "No sir, I never did."

He said he had never touched the boy's genitals or had sexual intercourse with him, and added: "I have never, ever, had sexual intercourse with another man. It is not something that interests me at all."

He admitted that he thought the teenager was bisexual and had told him of his own bisexual background. But he denied having any sexual motives for his friendship with the boy.

Holland said: "He was aware that I am bisexual. I'm the kind of person that if I feel somebody ought to know, then I will tell them. I believed that he was of the same persuasion as myself.

"A lot of people will talk about things that they won't tell their parents or even their friends about. He was very fond of me. The same as I was of him. He would even tell me I was his best friend. He would tell me that he loved me. It wasn't a sexual thing, it was affection.

"There might have been the odd hug or something like that. I know it is politically incorrect nowadays but kids like to be shown a bit of affection.

"He suggested that when he was 18 he could come and live with me. I know what I should have said. I should have told him flat 'no, that is never going to happen', but I don't like upsetting people's feelings. I tried to talk to him in a way that would suggest that it was not something that would be acceptable to me, without saying an outright 'no'."

Maria Savvides, prosecuting, told the court that the alleged abuse was revealed in a letter written by the teenager to his parents on December 14, 2002.

Miss Savvides told the court: "In about the spring of 2002 he started to visit the defendant's home in Stoke Bruerne. What he says is that he went to his teacher's house. He was asked to go upstairs and take a shower. He came downstairs and was forced to participate in oral sex.

"The defendant performed oral sex on him and the defendant forced (the teenager) to perform oral sex on him."

Giving evidence today, Holland denied having any sexual desires towards the youngster. He said he asked the teenager to take a shower one afternoon as he smelled strongly of alcohol and tobacco.

Mr Joyce asked: "Did you ask him to go and take a shower?"

"On one occasion," replied Holland. "He was left in the house by himself. He'd been drinking heavily, smoking heavily and he had made a bit of a mess of himself and he smelled."

"Did you ever see him naked?"

"No," he said.

In cross examination, Nicola Cafferkey, defence counsel for Laouitaris, alleged that Holland had arranged the visits of Laouitaris and the teenager in order to instigate sex between the three.

Holland said: "Don't be ridiculous, madam, I resent the innuendo."

Miss Savvides said that the boy's parents had encouraged the drum lessons in order to improve their son's self-esteem and, because of the growing relationship between teacher and pupil, had allowed their son to stay over at his home on a number of occasions.

The trial, before Judge Charles Wide QC, has heard that the teenager had suffered problems at school from an early age and took part in a number of activities to improve his learning difficulties.

Holland joined Judas Priest in 1979 and played with them for the next 10 years in their heyday.

The Birmingham-based band reached Number 12 in the British charts in 1980 with two records, Living After Midnight and Breaking The Law. They had several other Top 20 hits but never reached the Top 10 in the UK.

Holland was born in Northampton and is still involved in the local music scene.

The trial was adjourned until tomorrow


*****


Press Association
January 22, 2004

EX-ROCK STAR JURY SENT HOME FOR NIGHT

Andrew Barrow

A jury trying a former rock star accused of attempting to rape a special needs youngster while giving drum lessons has been sent home for the night after failing to agree a verdict.

David Holland, the former drummer of rock band Judas Priest, faces one charge of attempted rape and five counts of indecent assault on the 17-year-old boy. All of the alleged offences are said to have taken place at the drummer's rural home between June and December 2002.


Holland's co-accused, Spiros Laouitaris, 22, faces three separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager. He was acquitted of a fourth indecent assault charge on the directions of Judge Charles Wide QC, who said there had been insufficient evidence.

Holland, 55, of The Green, Stoke Bruerne, Northants, and Laouitaris, of Bourne Crescent, Kings Heath, Northampton, deny all the charges.

In summing up the case, Judge Wide told the jury of seven women and five men to put aside any feelings about the bisexual rock star's sex life.

He said: "This is not a court of morals and not a place for emotions."

Northampton Crown Court has heard that the alleged assaults began in spring 2002 when the boy, who cannot be named for legal reasons, began staying over at Holland's cottage. It was said that the rock drummer and Laouitaris forced the teenager to perform sex acts upon them and then assaulted the boy.

Prosecution counsel Maria Savvides told the jury of seven women and five men that the alleged abuse was revealed in a letter written by the teenager to his parents on December 14, 2002, which detailed the allegations of abuse.

Holland denies the charges and any sexual desires towards the youngster - calling the charges "ridiculous".

In closing, his barrister, Michael Joyce, said Holland was a man who had made a positive contribution to village life in Stoke Bruerne and to the music industry.

But Laouitaris's barrister, Nicola Cafferkey, sought to apportion blame on Holland saying that he had taken advantage of two people with learning difficulties.

She said: "When Holland, a man in his 50s, met Spiros, who was 20 or 21, immediately he tells you he realises that Spiros was 'below par'."

The jury was ordered to continue its deliberations tomorrow.


*****


Press Association

January 23, 2004

DRUMMER GUILTY OF TEENAGE BOY RAPE BID


Andrew Barrow


Rock drummer David Holland was convicted today of attempting to rape a special needs teenager while giving him drum lessons at his rural home.

Holland, the former drummer of rock band Judas Priest, was convicted of one charge of attempted rape and five counts of indecent assault on the 17-year-old at Holland's rural Northamptonshire home between June and December 2002.

Holland, 55, of The Green, Stoke Bruerne, Northants, was convicted on majority verdicts by the jury of seven women and five men at Northampton Crown Court.

His co-accused, Sprios Laouitaris, 22, of Bourne Crescent, Kings Heath, Northampton, was earlier acquitted of three separate indecent assault charges on the same teenager.

He was cleared of a fourth indecent assault charge yesterday on the directions of Judge Charles Wide QC, who said there had been insufficient evidence.


Remanding the former rock star into custody, Judge Charles Wide QC ordered a pre-sentence report on Holland, saying: "I in particular would be interested in an assessment of the risk Mr Holland poses to adolescent young men. It is a matter of considerable concern to me."

Northampton Crown Court has heard that the assaults began in spring 2002 when the boy, who cannot be named for legal reasons, began staying over at Holland's cottage. The rock drummer forced the teenager to perform sex acts upon him before himself assaulting the boy.

Prosecution counsel Maria Savvides told the court that the accusations came to light in December 2002 when the teenager, who is now 18 but cannot be named for legal reasons, told his parents in a letter of his abuse while staying at Holland's house for drum lessons.

Counsel added: "It (the letter) revealed that things were happening at his drum teacher's house that shouldn't have been happening.

"In about the spring of 2002 he started to visit the defendant's home in Stoke Bruerne.

"What he says is that he went to his teacher's house. He was asked to go upstairs and take a shower. He came downstairs and was forced to participate in oral sex.

"The defendant performed oral sex on him and the defendant forced (the teenager) to perform oral sex on him."

In video evidence played to the court, the teenager described how Holland had tried to rape him but he had run away to "a warm corner of the cottage" and Holland had halted his advances.

Despite managing to stop Holland from raping him in his house, he said he had been abused in other ways, with the drummer using a sex toy on him on one occasion.

Referring to the rock drummer as "Dave", the boy described how the assaults started at Holland's cottage some six months after he began having lessons, initially at a drum shop in the centre of Northampton.

The first time I went round to his cottage, said the teenager. "It was right at the start of the summer holidays. He invited me."

The teenager said he felt "uncomfortable" when Holland tried to perform a sex act on him. He added: "I don't know if he does it to anyone else but he does it to me."

Miss Savvides said that the boy's parents had encouraged the drum lessons in order to improve their son's self-esteem and, because of the growing relationship between teacher and pupil, had allowed their son to stay over at his home on a number of occasions.

The teenager had suffered problems at school from an early age and took part in a number of activities to improve his learning difficulties.

Miss Savvides said: "The complainant is a young lad who from an early age had experienced problems and learning difficulties.

"His parents were at great pains to find activities that would help him with his own self-esteem. Drum lessons was something he could do and that he was happy with."

Holland joined Judas Priest in 1979 and played with them for the next 10 years in their heyday.

The Birmingham-based band reached Number 12 in the British charts in 1980 with two records, Living After Midnight and Breaking The Law. They had several other Top 20 hits but never reached the Top 10 in the UK.

The boy's father told the court how the teenager became aggressive towards his parents and scared to be alone after he was sexually abused by Holland.

Despite organising the lessons in order to boost his self esteem, the boy's father told how his son's manner changed after the abuse started at Holland's cottage in the Northamptonshire village.

"For us it was a very emotional time," he said. "He was very disturbed, really aggressive and mixed up. We noticed it.

"During the time he was going to Dave's we noted he was getting blotches on his arms, towards the end, the last few lessons. About the last time he went to Dave's he started to have baths every day. He doesn't like having baths.

"He didn't want us to go out. One of us had to stay with him. We would sit up on his bed and watch videos. He just clung to us, he was really disturbed."

Laouitaris's barrister, Nicola Cafferkey, blamed Holland for the attacks saying that he had taken advantage of two people with learning difficulties.

She said: "When Holland, a man in his 50s, met Spiros, who was 20 or 21, immediately he tells you he realises that Spiros was 'below par'."

Speaking outside the court, Mr Laouitaris said he was relieved that the case was over, saying: "There has been some justice but it has taken too long."

The 23-year-old Greek-Cypriot began texting family members with the message "I'm free".

Laouitaris's father Christopher added: "When it first happened and we found out we asked him to tell the truth. It was very uncomfortable for him."

Holland always claimed the charges were "ridiculous", and said that he had been just a friend to the boy.

Several other young music students appeared at Northampton Crown Court to give statements about his character.

The defendant said he had become a close friend to a number of his pupils, who had told him secrets in confidence, but said the teenager had become further attached, even asking if he could live with Holland once he had turned 18.

He admitted that he thought the teenager was also bisexual and had told him of his own sexual background. But he denied having any sexual motives for his friendship with the boy.

Holland told the court: "He was aware that I am bisexual. I'm the kind of person that if I feel somebody ought to know then I will tell them. I believed that he was of the same persuasion as myself.

"A lot of people will talk about things that they won't tell their parents or even their friends about. He was very fond of me. The same as I was of him. He would even tell me I was his best friend. He would tell me that he loved me. It wasn't a sexual thing, it was affection.

"There might have been the odd hug or something like that. I know it is politically incorrect nowadays but kids like to be shown a bit of affection."

Holland admitted that he was bisexual and had participated in gay sex acts but had never had full sex with another man. He owned and used pornographic videos and sex toys but denied ever showing them to the teenager or using them on him.


*****


WENN Entertainment News Wire Service
January 6, 2005

IOMMI ERRASES SEX OFFENDER FROM DEP SESSIONS

Rockers TONY IOMMI and GLENN HUGHES were forced to call in TEARS FOR FEARS drummer JIMMY COPLEY to revamp the beats on their lost DEP SESSIONS because they no longer wanted to be associated with a sex offender.

Jailed former JUDAS PRIEST star DAVE HOLLAND was the guest drummer on the 1996 project, which was locked away in one of Iommi's vaults until a pal stumbled across them and urged the BLACK SABBATH guitarist to consider releasing them.

But Iommi didn't want to put the album out with Holland's name attached to the project after the drummer was jailed in 2003 for attempting to rape a special-needs youth.

Iommi says, "The association he's got at the moment isn't something we wanted to be involved in... The recording wasn't that good."


*****


I followed the case of Dave Holland at the time as I was studying for my first Masters in Criminology. Now I am studying for a Masters in Forensic Psychology and the case had been brought to my attention again.


Holland is due out in 2012. He still denies the charges and claims he is writing a tell-all autobiography about how he was framed as he wants to speak out for all of the wrongfully-convicted sex offenders.


Really, Dave?


Really?


I believe he is guilty; there is no reason for him to have been made an example of and if the evidence was not there to convict, he would not have been in prison since 2004. An innocent man would also have won on appeal, don't you think?


People have a very negative view of children who claim to be sexually abused and the vast majority of cases do not even make it to court due to lack of evidence. There was enough evidence to get a conviction in this case.


I think the problem with Dave is he believes he did nothing wrong. Many sex offenders think like that. My piece on rape covers the victim blaming/guilt transference exhibited by many abusers. That can be found via a blog search.


I have included a piece I wrote a while ago about inaccuracies in witness testimony due to inappropriate questioning with a special focus on children. It is not perfect (I got a high pass but a little effort would have got me a distinction) but it shows where research is in relation to child abuse cases right now. I don't think people realise how reliable the criminal justice system is in relation to sex abuse. Young victims (referred to as witnesses as per the current stance in Forensic Psychology) are much more reliable than the general public believes and a claim of abuse cannot just be dismissed without proper investigation. Perhaps Dave ought to look at the evidence himself.


(It goes without saying that this was a piece I wrote for my Masters and while I have completed that module, this is all of my own work and you cannot reproduce it in any way, shape or form).


Witnesses are vital in criminal cases as they provide insight into what happened and their testimony can result in convictions. Witnesses can, however, give inaccurate information and so cannot be completely relied upon (Castelli et al, 2009). There are numerous reasons for these errors but the most focused upon is the idea that the methods used during the questioning process create false memories or misleading reports. Many issues have to be explored to understand exactly how far witnesses can be lead during the interview process (Leichtman and Ceci, 2009). There are other issues that need to be considered before it can be decided if this really is the case, though. Special consideration should be given to the case of children as more cases with children as the only witnesses are coming to the fore and so they are becoming central to the criminal justice system. Witnesses can lie in order to meet their own objectives and though research has shown that children can maintain a lie, even under direct questioning, when advised to do so by an adult (Quas et al, 2007), this is rather rare. Instead, most issues that result in inaccurate witness reports are much less deliberate.

Human memory can be open to errors (Castelli et al, 2009). There can be issues at the encoding, retention and questioning phases that can have a significant affect on what is remembered and reported. Memory can become distorted in the initially encoding stage for a variety of reasons (Castelli et al, 2009). Witnesses are able to remember events better if it is something that is familiar to them, such as something that happens regularly. With children in abuse situations, repeated events will improve their memory recall but they may have problems differentiating incidents from each other and may confuse details (Castelli et al, 2009). In highly stressful events, the witness tends to be able to encode the central details but not peripheral information (Castelli et al, 2009; Davis et al, 2009). While those witnesses who can remember lots of detail tend to be believed more, it does not mean that those who remember only the main facts are any less reliable (Castelli et al, 2009). Should a witness only observe part of an event, they may use their own knowledge and experiences to create a full memory and fill in any gaps in the knowledge available, such as if a witness see a suspect holding something, they may assume it is a weapon (Castelli et al, 2009). While this can be useful in that information is encoded quickly and remembered clearly, the risk of false memories being created is great and can have an effect on the reliability of the witness (Castelli et al, 2009).

Research has shown that a witness is likely to forget most details soon after the event but then normally manages to retain certain information, as long as they are able to retrieve it later on (Castelli et al, 2009). Witnesses can lose details about events or they can become altered. Over time, the memory can also be affected by either media input or what other witnesses or friends or family members say (Castelli et al, 2009; Ost et al, 2009). Length of time between the event witnessed and the interview process does have an effect on memory retention though it is also believed that if a witness is able to really focus on an event, they will remember the details no matter how much time passes before retrieval occurs (Castelli et al, 2009). There is little evidence that children are likely to forget details over time (Castelli et al, 2009). Children can, however, be affected by the behaviour of those around them more than adults, such as negative influence from parents or other adults can create false or distorted memories during retention (Castelli et al, 2009).

It is believed that during the retrieval process is when most errors are likely to occur (Castelli et al, 2009). Many times, a witness is unable to report what they have seen or experienced due to retrieval issues (Castelli et al, 2009). This can include problems like the style of questioning or a lack of appropriate retrieval cues to encourage witnesses to report the facts. The questioning phase is important as it is at this point where the event is recalled by the witness and the way this takes place can have an impact on the entire case. It is believed that either misleading or suggestive questioning can cause witnesses to give false statements (Melnyk et al, 2009). Various things can happen during questioning that will influence the information reported by the witness. It is preferable to interview the witness as soon as possible but even if there is a delay in this, such as cases of child abuse discovered many years after the initial event, witnesses are still able to accurately report on what happened to them (Castelli et al, 2009).

The issue of misleading or suggestive questioning has been of concern for years, due to high-profile cases where convictions were later overturned. Misleading questions can include asking direct questions where details are given to the witness that may not be true and because the person questioning is in a position of authority, most witnesses think it would be natural to just accept what they are saying as correct (Castelli et al, 2009). The significance of leading and suggestive questioning increases the longer after an event occurs. When an incident has just happened, witnesses are more likely to trust their own judgement and not automatically accept what is said to them but over time, witnesses are more inclined to include the information given to them by others as part of their own testimony (Castelli et al, 2009). The language used is important as the use of strong verbs can influence witnesses (Castelli et al, 2009). The status of the interviewer can influence the creation of false memories as the witness may believe that the authority figure must be correct and they either doubt themselves or fear disagreeing with the interviewer and so change their own testimony to fit in with what the interviewer expects (Quas et al, 2007; Castelli et al, 2009).

Research has shown that very young children are more likely to be open to suggestibility while older children perform on a more similar level to adults (Paz-Alonso and Goodman, 2009). A large problem with children is that they know much more than they are actually able to express so without the correct type of questioning, they have no way of sharing their knowledge (Castelli et al, 2009). Children can struggle when being questioned as consideration is sometimes not given to their limited language skills and so children can either not understand what is being asked of them or have no way of responding correctly as they just lack the vocabulary with which to do so (Castelli et al, 2009). While suggestive and misleading questions are a concern with children, it largely only has an influence over minor details that have little relevance to the event being reported with children being much more difficult to guide in their statements than people generally believe (Castelli et al, 2009). It is only in cases where the child has a very weak recall or grasp on the important event that central details can be shaped by the questioner (Castelli et al, 2009).

Some interview aspects used with children can actually make things worse. One practice used during the interview process with children is the use of dolls. These are favoured by some who feel they help children express themselves better but research suggests that they actually cause more problems as children are unable to relate their own experiences to the dolls and so it causes more confusion of the facts (Castelli et al, 2009; Melnyk et al, 2009). While the use of dolls is favoured as it is believed to allow children to express things they cannot normally communicate, research has actually proven that the use of dolls causes false reports of abuse as children cannot always relate to the doll themselves and so they do not really understand what they are expressing and can actually give completely misleading information (Melnyk et al, 2009).

The interview can seem like a hostile process to a young witness and that can cause them to be intimidated by the interviewer and therefore be more eager to satisfy their perceived expectations (Melnyk et al, 2009). Research has shown that children are less open to suggestibility if the interview is conducted in a supportive, positive way (Melnyk et al, 2009). This does not always happen, though, due to interviewer bias. Interviewers can show a lack of patience when dealing with young witnesses and so are more likely to ask direct questions in order to quickly obtain the details they need to move forward. This type of questioning is unfair to the child as they can feel pressure to say what they think the interviewer wants to hear instead of the truth and it can leave them disillusioned with the system as true justice is not found. An investigator may have already started to make assumptions about the case and so they have their own direction in which to take the interview. Interview bias is a concern as it is possible for an interviewer to allow their own opinions and objectives to contaminate the interview process, sometimes even subconsciously (Brigham et al, 2009; Melnyk et al, 2009; Valentine, 2009). The concerns can range from asking leading questions to repeating the same question to the point that the witness begins to believe the answer they have given is not acceptable and so they change it to suit the interviewer. This is especially significant with child witnesses who may not be sure of themselves enough to understand why they would be repeatedly asked the same question and so begin to doubt themselves (Leichtman and Ceci, 2009; Melnyk et al, 2009).

The process of repeated interviewing can also show bias on the part of investigators as they are constantly trying to find the exact information they want in order to take the investigation in the direction they believe it should be going (Quas et al, 2007; Melnyk et al, 2009). Research by Goodman and Quas (2008), however, suggests that children are able to resist suggestibility and interviewer bias in repeated interviews if they are interviewed soon after the event when they are able to realise that the information they hold is actually accurate. The authors admit that there is still conflicting evidence and so further research is required before anything substantial can be decided (Goodman and Quas, 2008). Repeated interviewing can be useful with children as it allows them to think about what happened in great detail and therefore report more information than they could have just one question session but this can also lead to a lot of inaccurate reporting as a child may think they keep being asked the same question or type of question repeatedly because their initial answers were wrong and so they can start to alter their reports in the hope that what they later say will be more acceptable to the interviewer (Castelli et al, 2009). Direct questioning is not an entirely bad thing and can be useful to obtain specific information but care should always be taken to ensure that the witness is not being unduly pressured or guided by the interviewer as that can be detrimental to the case.

The issue of false memories created during the questioning process with children is something that the media like to focus on, especially after the number of high-profile cases in which convictions were over-turned due to false testimony by child witnesses. It has been established that children can suffer from false memories but only if certain criteria are reached, such as the event being suggested to them is actually plausible and they believe that it could possibly have happened to them (Ost et al, 2009). In their 2008 study, Ost et al (2009) explored the suggestibility of adults concerning an invented piece of video footage and discovered high rates of suggestibility amongst adults but this was in relation to an event that had extensive media coverage but they also established that those most likely to report false memories were more prone to fantasies and so they could have just imagined it anyway (Ost et al, 2009). Children are less likely to accept something completely new but if minor details of an event they are already aware of are altered slightly, they are more likely to include this in their own reports (Castelli et al, 2009). Adults are also able to have this problem of believing created memories but it is less likely and so not as great a concern.

Children are able to give accurate statements when allowed to. In their 2000 study of child sexual abuse victims in New Zealand, Bidrose and Goodman established that children provide the most accurate information when they are not excessively interviewed and when they are allowed to use free-narrative without too much direct questioning (Bidrose and Goodman, 2009). Children are not as open to suggestibility as people believe (Castelli et al, 2009). A child witness who is sure of what they observed and is interviewed in a safe, positive environment with open-ended questions is highly likely to give an accurate report and be no more likely to report false memories than an adult in the same circumstances. In fact, it has been argued that if a child is exposed to suggestive interview techniques soon after the event, it actually encourages them to report the facts correctly as they are more sure of their own version of events and so can argue their own case more confidently (Castelli et al, 2009). It is slightly different with very young children who are more inclined to follow what adults say and can be influenced by inappropriate or misleading questioning (Castelli et al, 2009).

While eyewitness testimony is favoured because it is believed to be reliable, in reality, it is open to many problems that can result in innocent people being imprisoned (Castelli et al, 2009). It cannot be confirmed that all inaccuracies in witness testimony are due to the style of questioning used, though, as so many other factors play a role in the development in errors. Suggestibility in adult witnesses only occurs in a small number of cases as witnesses are usually able to maintain their own version of events. Children can remember events clearly but can have problems with reporting the information at a later date and so care has to be taken in the methods with which children are questioned (Castelli et al, 2009). The instances of children actually reporting false memories is actually very rare (Castelli et al, 2009). The problem may not be with children but the adults who deal with them after an event and their lack of understanding of the best way to work with child witnesses (Castelli et al, 2009). While there are some concerns about the suggestibility of children, research suggests that the biggest issue is with very young children and over time, the chance of interviewers being able to shape their statements does reduce and so is not as much of an issue as initially thought (Leichtman and Ceci, 2009; Menyk et al, 2009). Children are able to resist suggestibility when it comes to abuse-related questions and are more likely to be lead on small matters rather than anything significant (Castelli et al, 2009; Melnyk et al, 2009). Therefore, while questioning issues are present and should be examined, other factors have to be considered when evaluating the cause of inaccuracies in witness statements.


References

Bidrose, S. And Goodman, G.S. (2009) ‘Testimony and evidence: A scientific case study of memory for child sexual abuse’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Brigham, J.C., Bennett, L.B., Meissner, C.A., and Mitchell, T.L. (2009) ‘The influence of race on eyewitness memory’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Castelli, P., Goodman, G.S., Edelstein, R.S., Mitchell, E.B., Alonso, P.M.P., Lyons, K.E., and Newton, J.W. (2009) ‘Evaluating Eyewitness Testimony in Adults and Children’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. (eds.) Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Chichester, John Wiley & Sons Ltd

Davis, D., Loftus, E.F., Vanous, S., and Cucciare, M. (2009) ‘’Unconscious transference’ can be an instance of ‘change blindness’’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Goodman, G.S. and Quas, J.A. (2008) ‘Repeated Interviews and Children’s Memory: It’s More Than Just How Many’. Current Directions in Psychological Science, 17 (386), [Online]. Available from http://cdp.sagepub.com/content/17/6/386.full.pdf+html (Accessed 1 December 2010)

Leichtman, M.D. and Ceci, S.J. (2009) ‘The effects of stereotypes and suggestions on preschoolders’ reports’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Melnyk, L., Crossman, A.M., and Scullin, M. (2009) ‘The Suggestibility of Children’s Memory’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. (eds.) Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Chichester, John Wiley & Sons Ltd

Ost, J., Granhag, P., Udell, J., and Roos, E. (2009) ‘Familiarity breeds distortion: The effects of media exposure on false reports concerning media coverage of the terrorist attacks in London on 7 July 2005’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Paz-Alonso, P.M. and Goodman, G.S. (2009) ‘Trauma and memory: effects of post-event misinformation, retrieval order, and retention interval’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. Critical Readings in Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Milton Keynes, The Open University

Quas, J.A., Davis, E.L., Goodman, G.S., and Myers, J.E.B. (2007) ‘Repeated Questions, Deception, and Children’s True and False Reports of Body Touch’. Child Maltreatment, 12 (1), [Online]. Available from http://cmx.sagepub.com/content/12/1/60.full.pdf+html (Accessed 1 December 2010)

Valentine, T. (2009) ‘Identifying Perpetrators’ in Motzkau, J., Pike, G., Briggs, G., Brace, N., and Turner, J. (eds.) Forensic Psychology: Witnesses, Experts and Evidence on Trial, Chichester, John Wiley & Sons Ltd